steadyshot
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Because the mentality in ASR is if something exists we should already have measured it. If not it is placebo
Qobuz & Wiim Pro and Mini
- Thread starter Maurizio
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It's not the ASR mentality. Existence of anything is based on the proof of being detected or measured if you prefer such word. That's the contradiction to beliefs.
Different approaches complement each other. It's always weird to me why it's so hard to understand by some people. You can negate the value of scientific way, I do not care. I use both.If you would replace esoteric with emotional you get my signature
For me there is nothing more unsexy and unemotional than a graph. But I am sure we are not really far away from each other because I wouldn't expect you chose your time intensive methods without loving music.
Maybe this way is perfect for constructing bridges or skycrapers. For an emotional thing like music it stays as a wrong way for me. "Contradiction to beliefs" is exact the mentality ASR rules. No way than this way. Ignorant and presumptuous. Like "untrained or average listeners".
Patricia P
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@onlyoneme dont you get it - @Achim1811 loves a good pun, and in his second language too! If we were ready to be guided by the social media influencers we would have bought the latest £££ streamer, and wouldnt be here.
I don't care. I'm untrained and average listener, I'm fine with that. I would be also fine with excrement lovers who prefer to have an emotional relation to such things. I just see a difference between biased and unbiased judgements and I treat them differently.
If something measures very bad it won't sound good even if it sounds pleasant for someone, as I expect high fidelity first when talking about an audio equipment.
If something measures very bad it won't sound good even if it sounds pleasant for someone, as I expect high fidelity first when talking about an audio equipment.
steadyshot
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What about matter in the universe ? Can we measure it all currently?
Patricia P
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The answer is 42, what was the question again?
No point to continue such discussion. Existence of matter itself in unrelated to the proven or unproven existence of every particle we can imagine as being a part of the whole matter.
@Achim1811
Ha,ha,really you are the best
. Mao? Confucio? Who are they? I only know Achim the wise. Of course I'm kidding. Talking seriously. I agree, FIRST you have to fix the devices of the main chain . Only then you can think about the rest. Can a DAC "bring a remarkable higher level"? No, but it can make it all sound different.N. B. Just different, neither better nor worse.
By the way, I am absolutely in love with my vintage combo. It has the charm of an old lady
Do I stand at the window to see if a younger woman I like better passes by? Of course yes
Me too I believe in my ears, not measurementsI agree that current measurement methodology is insufficient to capture all sonic differences. And because in the end we have to live with the equipment I prefer to like what I hear!
Measurements and the scientific approach in general tell something about things that our ears cannot detect. Do you negate everything your personal senses didn't experience so far?
If a proper measurement says that a device has high level of odd, uneven harmonics, that's a fact. It can be negligible or even favorable, but these distortions exist.
It's like negating being seriously sick just because of good feeling...
It's like negating being seriously sick just because of good feeling...
For me there is a post in memory which more or less read "not listenable, but you can measure". So, who cares? What can happen? Will the earth open and let me fall to hell? My big guns is a combi of E-4000 with the DAC option. In the often mentioned forum it gave the recommendation "better two Topping LA90" or so. More power and better graphs. Really?
My streamer for this is a Node X. And its fantastic, all what I want from a digital item. Measurements? You could fear I die.
If anyone for any reason is near Düsseldorf in Germany he or she is invited to check.
I will stay that it is never ever the right way to combine only by measurement. It is different with headphones and speakers where frequency response can point you to the direction you want. But even this is absolutely impossible way for every listening situation. Nothing can replace testing in your environment with your existing gear. Would be difficult with no helpful, serious and potent dealer, I know.
My streamer for this is a Node X. And its fantastic, all what I want from a digital item. Measurements? You could fear I die.
If anyone for any reason is near Düsseldorf in Germany he or she is invited to check.
I will stay that it is never ever the right way to combine only by measurement. It is different with headphones and speakers where frequency response can point you to the direction you want. But even this is absolutely impossible way for every listening situation. Nothing can replace testing in your environment with your existing gear. Would be difficult with no helpful, serious and potent dealer, I know.
steadyshot
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I like measurements and objectivity . I like someone to keep reigns to the companies .I like also a more humble approach because it is clear that there are things that can not be currently measured and we should trust our ears
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What I do not like is the often, not always! so presented meanings that the developers and engineers in longtime building high fidelity companies are idiots. They develop and construct, do market research and the first thing they hear or read is: "You failed and we can do it better!" Easily said because they know they never have to prove it. This is what I mean when mentioning "first semester students". And when I trust in companies like Accuphase, Marantz, McIntosh, Denon, Pioneer and so on today I will not be disappointed in their dedicated price ranges. The time that there must be a control or so is longtime gone. May be its mainstream, but I trust in it. Fool I am. But it saves money at the end of the day. I sold my LP12 for nearly the same amount I bought it, including the updates. That is the cheapest way to handle the hobby. Am sure if I try that with a chinoix years later it will not work.
So, thats it for me. Maybe I am the bad guy already, sorry for that and I will read further, but the conflict between the listeners and the measurers is not to solve and I will stay back.
So, thats it for me. Maybe I am the bad guy already, sorry for that and I will read further, but the conflict between the listeners and the measurers is not to solve and I will stay back.
Plenty of companies do what they do because there are people around who believe that these companies do their best in terms of quality and involved expertise level, apart of the fact that in most cases it's just for money. And this is the approach which lets such companies exist and earn tremendous money - the believers.
Correct then your room acoustic successfully without a proper gear and measurements, just with your ears. Good luck.
Ignorance can irritate sometimes.
And as I said, sum of nonaudible but measurable issues can result in something perfectly audible.
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