Echo Studio as powered speaker for WiiM Pro

[timmo]

I might get lambasted with this idea but I am heavily invested in the Alexa and Sonos ecosystems. I have an Echo Studio where I recently plugged a WiiM Mini into it via optical and it works and sounds really great (I was surprised in how well it works). I’m thinking of getting a WiiM Pro in its place (mainly so I can use it as a Roon Ready endpoint in that room). Do ya’ll think I’m crazy? Just curious as to folks thoughts on this one … and thank you

 

[Stessull]

I might get lambasted with this idea but I am heavily invested in the Alexa and Sonos ecosystems. I have an Echo Studio where I recently plugged a WiiM Mini into it via optical and it works and sounds really great (I was surprised in how well it works). I’m thinking of getting a WiiM Pro in its place (mainly so I can use it as a Roon Ready endpoint in that room). Do ya’ll think I’m crazy? Just curious as to folks thoughts on this one … and thank you

I have the same and as you say it sounds remarkably good. I wouldn't use a WiiM Pro, I think that would be overkill. I would just use airplay, pretty sure any difference in SQ on the Studio would be minimal.

 

[timmo]

I have the same and as you say it sounds remarkably good. I wouldn't use a WiiM Pro, I think that would be overkill. I would just use airplay, pretty sure any difference in SQ on the Studio would be minimal.

I don’t think I can AirPlay to it (not built-in, but should be able to use the new AirPlay Cast feature recently added by WiiM to do so via the Mini). I would like to make the Echo Studio a Roon Ready endpoint (so a WiiM Pro would be required in the Mini’s place). The sound quality of the Echo Studio is impressive.

 

[Brantome]

I don’t think I can AirPlay to it (not built-in, but should be able to use the new AirPlay Cast feature recently added by WiiM to do so via the Mini). I would like to make the Echo Studio a Roon Ready endpoint (so a WiiM Pro would be required in the Mini’s place). The sound quality of the Echo Studio is impressive.

Mmm, wouldn’t have thought to do that tbh, but fair play. What resolution does the Studio take? The U.K. and USA spec seems to be different, down to firmware I think.

 

[timmo]

Mmm, wouldn’t have thought to do that tbh, but fair play. What resolution does the Studio take? The U.K. and USA spec seems to be different, down to firmware I think.

I’m not sure how to properly answer that other than what they list in the specs (unless I can tell some other way?):



I hear you about the firmware (and generation of speaker). I purposely bought the Galcier white version as that is the “2nd gen” and wanted to make sure I had the latest hardware in it. When I reviewed Amazon comments I got the impression that the Glacier white is ’more updated’ than the black one (1st gen). With all the negative reviews about problems with optical in, I don’t have those (and wondering if it’s because they have the ‘1st gen’ version(?)). Anyways - so far my experience has been great with this combo.

 

[Brantome]

I’m not sure how to properly answer that other than what they list in the specs (unless I can tell some other way?):

View attachment 2150

I hear you about the firmware (and generation of speaker). I purposely bought the Galcier white version as that is the “2nd gen” and wanted to make sure I had the latest hardware in it. When I reviewed Amazon comments I got the impression that the Glacier white is ’more updated’ than the black one (1st gen). With all the negative reviews about problems with optical in, I don’t have those (and wondering if it’s because they have the ‘1st gen’ version(?)). Anyways - so far my experience has been great with this combo.

There’s no 1st and 2nd gen, just black and white. Both are updated to the same firmware level. If you listen to the September Devices event where the additional features were announced, there’s no talk of new hardware at all, just new firmware. It did cause some confusion tbh.

Re resolution, I meant what resolution have you chosen on the WiiM Mini’s optical output - when running the audio test, does it play the test tone right up to 24/192?

I had a sneaking suspicion that the Studio maxed out at 24/48 (which in amazon terms is still UHD) from something I read in Wired magazine when it first came out, and from the fact that in multi room with my Pro and Studio, I couldn’t get more than 24/48 - but that might be an Alexa MRM limit, not the Studio per se.

 

[timmo]

There’s no 1st and 2nd gen, just black and white. Both are updated to the same firmware level. If you listen to the September Devices event where the additional features were announced, there’s no talk of new hardware at all, just new firmware. It did cause some confusion tbh.

Re resolution, I meant what resolution have you chosen on the WiiM Mini’s optical output - when running the audio test, does it play the test tone right up to 24/192?

I had a sneaking suspicion that the Studio maxed out at 24/48 (which in amazon terms is still UHD) from something I read in Wired magazine when it first came out, and from the fact that in multi room with my Pro and Studio, I couldn’t get more than 24/48 - but that might be an Alexa MRM limit, not the Studio per se.

That’s true there really isn’t a 1st and 2nd gen (why I used quotes around ‘2nd gen’ ). With all the research I did at the time, I got the impression there ‘might‘ be some difference between black and white (just can’t find anything official on that). To be safe I just went with the white version (in case the black version wouldn’t have the same updated components as the newly introduced white version).

I’ll do the test you mention when I get back home - great idea

 

[Brantome]

That’s true there really isn’t a 1st and 2nd gen (why I used quotes around ‘2nd gen’ ). With all the research I did at the time, I got the impression there ‘might‘ be some difference between black and white (just can’t find anything official on that). To be safe I just went with the white version (in case the black version wouldn’t have the same updated components as the newly introduced white version).

I’ll do the test you mention when I get back home - great idea

Nah, nothing different but you’re not alone in thinking that. One the product page now, black (aka charcoal) and glacier white appear as options same as they do for other echo models.

If I had a mini optical cable (in amongst the several boxes of cables I have) I could try it myself

 

[Wiimer]

I might get lambasted with this idea but I am heavily invested in the Alexa and Sonos ecosystems. I have an Echo Studio where I recently plugged a WiiM Mini into it via optical and it works and sounds really great (I was surprised in how well it works). I’m thinking of getting a WiiM Pro in its place (mainly so I can use it as a Roon Ready endpoint in that room). Do ya’ll think I’m crazy? Just curious as to folks thoughts on this one … and thank you

Hi, dear @timmo.

You may be crazy for sure, but I don't think so.
You're a very fun and interesting guy.

I used to own two Echo studios and an Echo sub. The sound was very impressive. However, I gave up all of them because the stereo pair malfunction lasted for more than two months.

If I still had two Echo studios, I would want to try stereo playback in the following ways:

WiiM Pro
|---> (AirPlay) > Mini 1 > (OPT) > EchoStudio 1 [R]
|--- Mini 2 > (OPT) > EchoStudio 2 [L]

Connect Mini 1 and mini 2 via Linkplay MRM for stereo playback on the two EchoStudios.
(EchoStudio 1 outputs the audio on the right, and 2 outputs the audio on the left)

Sorry, this has absolutely nothing to do with your post. But I was so curious to see if this would work, I couldn't help but write it.

 

[timmo]

Hi, dear @timmo.

You may be crazy for sure, but I don't think so.
You're a very fun and interesting guy.

I used to own two Echo studios and an Echo sub. The sound was very impressive. However, I gave up all of them because the stereo pair malfunction lasted for more than two months.

If I still had two Echo studios, I would want to try stereo playback in the following ways:

WiiM Pro
|---> (AirPlay) > Mini 1 > (OPT) > EchoStudio 1 [R]
|--- Mini 2 > (OPT) > EchoStudio 2 [L]

Connect Mini 1 and mini 2 via Linkplay MRM for stereo playback on the two EchoStudios.
(EchoStudio 1 outputs the audio on the right, and 2 outputs the audio on the left)

Sorry, this has absolutely nothing to do with your post. But I was so curious to see if this would work, I couldn't help but write it.

Hi @Wiimer - I always look forward to hearing from you my friend, and thank you for the nice words I like to make people smile when I can (we all don’t smile enuf in this world, so anything to make it a lighter place to live out our lives in is a win in my book). [I’m sure I annoy others though too … and I’m okay with that - just block me and I won’t be the wiser and all is good ]

@Brantome I’m home now and tried out the tests (thank you for the tip in using the app for resolutions tests - I wish all apps had that functionality built in). Attached below is my scientific paper I wrote up using my Kindle Scribe (finally a use for the Notebooks feature! ) on this subject with the corresponding results (and scientists all around the world are rolling their eyes uncontrollably):


Legend:
Circle = Winner Winner Chicken Dinner

So 24/48 is the max it supports, and I’m okay with that (I don’t think I would be able to tell the difference to be honest). My Denon AVR supports up to 24/96, so when I want to group these puppies together (2 WiiM Pros + WiiM Mini), I’m assuming I should use the lowest common denominator of 24/48 set on all 3 WiiMs.

I did a quick test with Tidal and confirmed it can’t go past 24/48 to the mini into Echo Studio when playing hi-res music (but it works when playing normal CD-quality music from Tidal).

So I think I‘m happy I didn’t get lambasted on this idea (but it’s still early!) … so maybe my thinking is okay in implementing this kind of setup. I’m really looking for a solid Roon experience to replace my Sonos gear in the long-term … and this is a stepping stone on that path in figuring out the best solution for my particular setup.

@Wiimer I really really wish I had an extra Echo Studio and Echo Sub to perform your tests … in fact, I am just so close to purchasing this extra un-needed equipment for my home to do this for you but I better keep my wallet in check If I did purchase it, I would definitely get the black version of Echo Studio to rule out any suspicions I have in my brain about any kind of hardware difference between the two

 

[Wiimer]

If I did purchase it, I would definitely get the black version of Echo Studio to rule out any suspicions I have in my brain about any kind of hardware difference between the two

If that happens, I'll give you a white paint.

 

[Guest1]

If that happens, I'll give you a white paint.

Isn't that racist?

 

[timmo]

I did some MRM tests and it turns out I can keep 24/96 on WiiM Pro (connected to Denon) and 24/48 on WiiM Mini, and it plays perfectly fine. What it does though is downsample the music once they are grouped together, which is great because I can keep the maximized Denon connection setting (and not have to change it manually when I want to use MRM). The sync is perfect too - can’t believe how well this all works (amazing job, WiiM!).

 

[Wiimer]

Isn't that racist?

Sorry, I'll send a 24-color set of paints.

 

[Brantome]

I did some MRM tests and it turns out I can keep 24/96 on WiiM Pro (connected to Denon) and 24/48 on WiiM Mini, and it plays perfectly fine. What it does though is downsample the music once they are grouped together, which is great because I can keep the maximized Denon connection setting (and not have to change it manually when I want to use MRM). The sync is perfect too - can’t believe how well this all works (amazing job, WiiM!).

Thanks for confirming my suspicion that the Echo Studio only supported up to 24/48 - so basically Amazon’s premium speaker doesn’t support everything that their music service can deliver…

I’ll need to again try Alexa MRM with my Mini and Pro as it isn’t supposed to support lossless - there’s still the switch in the Wiim app for hd/UHD that we were advised to turn off when using Alexa MRM as the mini supposedly didn’t have the ram to support it…

 

[ps72]

Sorry for the threadjack...

I have a pair of echo studio's and an echo sub set as a group in my study.

I have a well curated iTunes library and lossless music collection on my synology server which I access via Mac, or Plex on the TV or Plex Amp on the iPhone

If I got a wiim pro or plus could I use it to stream music from my network or Spotify etc and have it use the Echo Studio group wirelessly as the speakers?
Thanks in advance for any guidance

 

[Brantome]

Sorry for the threadjack...

I have a pair of echo studio's and an echo sub set as a group in my study.

I have a well curated iTunes library and lossless music collection on my synology server which I access via Mac, or Plex on the TV or Plex Amp on the iPhone

If I got a wiim pro or plus could I use it to stream music from my network or Spotify etc and have it use the Echo Studio group wirelessly as the speakers?
Thanks in advance for any guidance

No, there’s not a published protocol to allow third party devices like WiiM to do that directly like you could with an Echo Link.

Guess you could feed a WiiM’s output into an Echo Link’s inputs and for that to then redistribute that to other echo devices/ groups. (Note that this is only formally supported for USA Echo Links, although there’s supposedly a workaround for non-USA Echo Links)

 

[ps72]

No, there’s not a published protocol to allow third party devices like WiiM to do that directly like you could with an Echo Link.

Guess you could feed a WiiM’s output into an Echo Link’s inputs and for that to then redistribute that to other echo devices/ groups. (Note that this is only formally supported for USA Echo Links, although there’s supposedly a workaround for non-USA Echo Links)

Okay thank you. I will ponder on my options it’s a shame as I like the form factor of the studios on my desk and the sound quality is pretty decent for what they are.

 

[bom13]

I don’t think I can AirPlay to it (not built-in, but should be able to use the new AirPlay Cast feature recently added by WiiM to do so via the Mini). I would like to make the Echo Studio a Roon Ready endpoint (so a WiiM Pro would be required in the Mini’s place). The sound quality of the Echo Studio is impressive.

Hi Timmo….this is a bit off topic to your ongoing Echo resolution discussion, but I wanted to ask about something in your note above. You remarked “should be able to use the new airplay cast feature recent added by Wiim to do so via the mini”. as I’m new to the Wiim world I was under the impression that the “cast” feature was only available via the Pro model. Can mini’s now cast also? If so I might be able to Re-purpose some of my old sonos Play5’s.

 

[Brantome]

Hi Timmo….this is a bit off topic to your ongoing Echo resolution discussion, but I wanted to ask about something in your note above. You remarked “should be able to use the new airplay cast feature recent added by Wiim to do so via the mini”. as I’m new to the Wiim world I was under the impression that the “cast” feature was only available via the Pro model. Can mini’s now cast also? If so I might be able to Re-purpose some of my old sonos Play5’s.

Airplay cast is only available on the Pro/Pro Plus - my reading of the above was that the Pro would be used to airplay to the mini which in turn would feed the Studio over optical, not that the mini was casting airplay.