Wiim Mini and External DAC Vs Pro Plus
- Thread starter Burt25
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alpha_zulu
Major Contributor
Felt every third day …
???
alpha_zulu
Major Contributor
DAC questions are very popular, especially with first-time posters.
Appreciate that.. I’m just looking for some guidance on getting streaming with a budget of around £350. I tried a Pro Plus which I was very impressed with but returned it thinking the Ultra may be the way to do when it comes out, but is it better to spend money on a mini and buy a separate DAC for around £250-£300 (possibly used)?
At the moment, the WiiM mini toslink connected to a dac, sounds as well as the pro. Limitations are just from the versatility point of view but in the near future who knows if some good features will be missing due to processing power?
alpha_zulu
Major Contributor
Why use two devices when you can get the same performance in one? The DAC of the WiiM Pro Plus is very, very decent. You can still connect a better one later if you miss anything at all. Invest as much as you can in the speakers, they have by far the biggest impact on SQ.
Have bough a Rega Brio with Fyne F302i Speakers which I’m very happy with and now want to add streaming for around £300- just want to get most bang for buck. The Pro plus is definitely high on my list and the upcoming Ultra may depending on price be the solution. I’m just curious if there’s anything to be gained by minimising spend on streamer and putting funds more into a separate DAC. Perhaps the differences are tiny?
alpha_zulu
Major Contributor
Probably negligible.
@Burt25 Started WiiM usage with my Pro and an external, not cheap DAC which was here already for a CD transport. Even when using the internal DAC from the Pro let me doubt my ears because I "heard" a difference only when I knew what was running. Since a few days I use the internal DAC from a new amp, my first amp with a digital section. Again, no audible differences for me.
I bet a Pro with an SMSL SU1 or something similar or a Pro Plus with its internal well regarded DAC together with the Brio, also a well regarded analog amp, could be all you need for streaming and you will end around 250 € in your currency.
My mantra: Save every free available coin for coming speaker upgrades. This is the place where the changes are audible.
I bet a Pro with an SMSL SU1 or something similar or a Pro Plus with its internal well regarded DAC together with the Brio, also a well regarded analog amp, could be all you need for streaming and you will end around 250 € in your currency.
My mantra: Save every free available coin for coming speaker upgrades. This is the place where the changes are audible.
AlanB
Major Contributor
I started with a WiiM Mini and soon bought a Topping EX5 DAC/Headphone Amp because the Mini's DAC is sonically poor. The Topping expired under warranty and I took the refund from Amazon. It was difficult to obtain a replacement directly from China because the price had gone up and I had to pay return postage and insurance. The combination sounded excellent to me though.
I replaced the Topping with a refurbished Cambridge DACMagic 200M directly from the factory for the same price as I had purchased the Topping for. It also sounded excellent but the build quality is far superior. It is also easy to return to the factory for repair in the UK should it ever be necessary.
I replaced the WiiM Mini with a Wiim Pro because I use Logitech Media Server to stream my own music from a laptop and at the time it was thought that the WiiM Mini wouldn't have the memory to accommodate Squeezelite.
I have no experience of the DAC in the WiiM Pro Plus, but it is well regarded. Personally I would get the Pro Plus because it has more development potential and connectivity than the Mini and see if you like the sound before purchasing a better DAC.
I replaced the Topping with a refurbished Cambridge DACMagic 200M directly from the factory for the same price as I had purchased the Topping for. It also sounded excellent but the build quality is far superior. It is also easy to return to the factory for repair in the UK should it ever be necessary.
I replaced the WiiM Mini with a Wiim Pro because I use Logitech Media Server to stream my own music from a laptop and at the time it was thought that the WiiM Mini wouldn't have the memory to accommodate Squeezelite.
I have no experience of the DAC in the WiiM Pro Plus, but it is well regarded. Personally I would get the Pro Plus because it has more development potential and connectivity than the Mini and see if you like the sound before purchasing a better DAC.
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Steve Woodhouse
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Same set up as me (WiiM Mini + Topping EX5).
When I move on to the Ultra, I’m thinking of keeping the Mini/EX5 combo purely for headphone use.
My logic is that, I’ll set up room correction and use PEQ, bass management etc., for my main speakers, and that’ll all be just left on all the time. The Mini (presuming we get a bit better PEQ) will have separate EQ settings for each pair of headphones, but that’s all.
If I only used the Ultra, I suspect it’d be a pain to constantly turn room correction, bass management, etc., on and off.
And I already have the Mini, and will be buying the Ultra anyway, so no extra cost.
Spending more on the speakers looks like funny advice for somebody who just bought brand new speakers (and probably for a reason). 
Anyway, I haven't heard either of the WiiM streamers (only just the Amp) so to come up with advice at least as funny
, I would vote for the WiiM Pro Plus, too.
The upcoming Ultra has been promised to sport an even better DAC, but it also comes with a bunch of features you will probably never use, @Burt25. If you have the patience to wait a little longer you might wait for the official introduction of the Ultra. Once you know the real difference in price you can decide if it's worth auditioning both of them or not.
Anyway, I haven't heard either of the WiiM streamers (only just the Amp) so to come up with advice at least as funny
, I would vote for the WiiM Pro Plus, too.The upcoming Ultra has been promised to sport an even better DAC, but it also comes with a bunch of features you will probably never use, @Burt25. If you have the patience to wait a little longer you might wait for the official introduction of the Ultra. Once you know the real difference in price you can decide if it's worth auditioning both of them or not.
Jefferson Hoëck
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I have had a Pro for a week, but it’s going back to Bezos Ltd, as it’s not what I’d hoped it might be.Spending more on the speakers looks like funny advice for somebody who just bought brand new speakers (and probably for a reason).
Anyway, I haven't heard either of the WiiM streamers (only just the Amp) so to come up with advice at least as funny
The upcoming Ultra has been promised to sport an even better DAC, but it also comes with a bunch of features you will probably never use, @Burt25. If you have the patience to wait a little longer you might wait for the official introduction of the Ultra. Once you know the real difference in price you can decide if it's worth auditioning both of them or not.
It was a speculative purchase, to be used as transport into a fairly old but decent Arcam irDAC. I compared it with my Apple 4KTV (used with an audio extractor to route an optical out into the same Arcam DAC), and I found the Wiim wasn’t any better.
A £20 audio extractor from Apple TV enabling optical connection to the DAC, was as good as the £150 Wiim Pro. I also tried a Tidal vs Apple Music test, over Airplay and using the Tidal Connect and Wiim in app Tidal, to see if there were any gains to be had over the Apple TV box. None to my ears. Which isn’t to slight the Wiim Pro, but probably indicates that my 15 year old DAC is levelling all the sound going in and out of it.
I tried line out from the Wiim to my Naim SN3 amp, but that wasn’t all that different. Almost indentical, in fact.
Not sure where to head next in my attempt to boost my streaming SQ performance. Better DAC? Better transport?
All that said, I’d recommend the Wiim Pro to anyone who didn’t already have a half decent streamer.
alpha_zulu
Major Contributor
This is not surprising to me. A streamer sends a digital signal to your DAC. Why should the WiiM do this better or worse than your AppleTV?
Jefferson Hoëck
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True enough, yes.
Some believe a transport itself can and does have a significant effect on sound quality, of course.
I’ve had a good few streamers and DACs down the years - including a Chromecast audio puck, Chord Poly/Mojo, Bluesound Node 2i, Qutest and currently ATV 4K + Arcam DAC - and they’ve all had a different sound characteristic but none have been vastly superior to each other.
In my case, streaming is secondary to CD and vinyl playback, and it’s just not close enough to CD, for me.
(Vinyl is an unfair comparison).
alpha_zulu
Major Contributor
Why should streaming‘s SQ be different to CD? In my opinion it‘s the same row of zeros and ones, translated from a DAC to an analogue signal. Maybe your CD-Player has a much better internal DAC than your Arcam is?!
(Provided, of course, that the stream is uncompressed and Hi-Res, at least CD quality ...)
(Provided, of course, that the stream is uncompressed and Hi-Res, at least CD quality ...)
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Jefferson Hoëck
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Streaming SQ always falls short for me, despite the possibly plausible theory that it’s all ones and zeros.
My Marantz SACD player has a great DAC, or rather it has a sound I really like. The Arcam DAC is a stop gap, until I decide on something more hopefully accomplished soon.
Streaming from Apple, Qobuz or Tidal - from past experience - has revealed some comparative difference, but none have been as satisfying as CD or SACD playback, leastways in my system.
I’m demo-ing two Naim streamers next week, and that may or may not change my view. Will see.
Generally and experientially, I’m of the school of thought, that thinks it’s the room, speakers and amps (in that order) that are the biggest influence on SQ outcome regardless of the actual format/method of delivery.