Dual Network Interface for WiiM Amp

[JirkaT]

Currently, WiFi is mutually exclusive with Ethernet. (When Ethernet cable is inserted, WiFi is disabled and vice versa.)

Would it be possible to have both network interfaces active at the same time? No routing, only 2 interfaces.

E.g., I would appreciate if I can control WiiM via WiFi (using mobile phone) while WiiM Amp can have Ethernet as source at the same time.

 

[Brantome]

You can already do that by dint of your router - you don't need to employ the wifi interface on the Amp

 

[JirkaT]

I am sorry, I do not understand. I am newbie in WiiM world, I am owner of WiiM Amp for about 24 hours

The only UI for WiiM Amp seems to be mobile phone with WiiM Home App. Mobile phone does not have Ethernet interface, therefore for WiiM configuration I have used WiFi. (I was trying configure WiiM with Ethernet cable plugged, but without success, thus I have unplugged it, reset the device and start again with WiFi, now successfully.)
After (success), I have plugged in Ethernet cable, resulting into fact that WiiM Home App on mobile now does not see the WiiM device. I am not able to tell it that that its address is now in different network.
On contrary, on my Win11 notebook, where I have installed WiiM Home app with both interfaces on pc, therefore I can see WiiM even after plugging in the Ethernet cable.
I hope that inside of WiiM Amp there is also an computer apparently with both (WiFI and Ethernet) interfaces (beside of BT). Thus why not ask, if it is possible to have both of them active

Alternativelly, if I can set WiiM ip address in WiiM Home app, or even have there both Eth and WiFi addresses (e.g. as 2 devices occurences), it will be also OK.
Or, if the connection between mobile phone and WiiM Amp is only BlueTooth, then it will not depend on (changing of) WiiM Amp network interface.

My configuration is:
ISP - ADSL - "Modem" - Firewall - LAN (192.168.10.*) - DLink DIR-505 - WiFi (192.168.0.*)

 

[hoohoohoo]

Currently, WiFi is mutually exclusive with Ethernet. (When Ethernet cable is inserted, WiFi is disabled and vice versa.)

Would it be possible to have both network interfaces active at the same time? No routing, only 2 interfaces.

E.g., I would appreciate if I can control WiiM via WiFi (using mobile phone) while WiiM Amp can have Ethernet as source at the same time.

Ran into this same issue. Because the WiiM and your phone communicate using some link-local multicast for service discovery, they need to be on the same Ethernet subnet because link-local multicast is never routed to another subnet (and has a time-to-live/TTL of 1 in the IP packet header, so it only goes 1 IP hop). So, in my case, the WiiM was on a wired Ethernet off my router (e.g. 192.168.1.0/24) and the WiFi for the house is off a wireless mesh router (192.168.86.0/24), so they don't talk across the NAT (a lightweight firewall) in the mesh router.

My solution was to add a Ubiquiti U6-IW which has both wired and wireless Ethernet in the sound room. Now both devices are on the same 192.168.1.0/24 subnet since it extends of my wired router. So, it's a bit of a pricier solution since it needs PoE which I already have, but it's nice to have a dedicated WiFi for audio control. A byproduct is that on my Android phone, I can set an http proxy (e.g. Privoxy) for this U6-IW WiFi only which helps with certain services.

 

[Brantome]

Looks like you have your ethernet and wifi on different subnets so that'll be why your phone app can't see your Amp. You can however enable wifi under network status in the WiiM app device settings but I don't know if that will allow different subnets to be used.

Why do you have separate subnets?

 

[d6jg]

Looks like you have your ethernet and wifi on different subnets so that'll be why your phone app can't see your Amp. You can however enable wifi under network status in the WiiM app device settings but I don't know if that will allow different subnets to be used.

Why do you have separate subnets?

Because his ISP shipped a router configured like that would be my guess. It's becoming more common and for those that don't know any different why would they ever question it.

 

[JirkaT]

You can however enable wifi under network status in the WiiM app device settings.

Now (my WiiM is on the Ethernet, while mobile phone on WiFi) I cannot really do anything in the WiiM Home app (on mobile phone): The WiiM device (in the app) is displayed as offline (from the point of view of the app). And rediscovery goes only through WiFi. So it looks that I cannot have LAN device and WiFi devices in the app.

Why do you have separate subnets?

Whole my home network started without WiFi at all. This was so till 2015 when I (maybe a little bit late ) switched myself from loved and best Nokia 6310i mobile phone to smartphone era. WiFi was only necessary for keeping my phone updated and also for my attempts of developing smartphone apps.
Only after slowly retiring myself I have started with development of home IOT and these small boxes start main usage of the WiFi connection while their central was/is securely kept on the LAN.

So why different networks?
I am from old school, remembering the time before Internet. For me it was (and still is) very natural to have routed networks, similar like having an extra firewall between Internet and my home network. (Safely ignoring crazy meshes like Philips bulbs etc.)
Additionally, at that time I was not interested in the "new" world of autodiscovery protocols that work only on 1 network.

Still one question is open:
Is the mutual exclusivity of WiFi and Ethernet on WiiM hard limit of HW, or limit of operating system used, or it is design decission of the application?

 

[jfbuk]

Hi,

this is not an ethernet vs WiFi issue.

Your phone is on a different subnet to your PC and Wiim.

SP - ADSL - "Modem" - Firewall - LAN (192.168.10.*) - DLink DIR-505 - WiFi (192.168.0.*)

I would hazard a guess that your phone cannot see your PC either given your network configuration

 

[JirkaT]

I would hazard a guess that your phone cannot see your PC either given your network configuration

My mobile can "see" not only the WiFi, but also the LAN and even the Firewall, the Modem. And even the Internet
The routing the key

 

[Brantome]

Still one question is open:
Is the mutual exclusivity of WiFi and Ethernet on WiiM hard limit of HW, or limit of operating system used, or it is design decission of the application

I mentioned above “You can however enable wifi under network status in the WiiM app device settings” when you have the Ethernet cable connected, but I don’t know if that will resolve your two subnets issue.

 

[jfbuk]

but can it see your PC ?

My mobile can "see" not only the WiFi, but also the LAN and even the Firewall, the Modem. And even the Internet
The routing the key

But can it see your PC ?

 

[shevans]

Beyond subnets, some router also isolate clients between wired and Wi-Fi and it’s a simple toggle in the Routers settings to turn on… “Client isolation”

Edit
Also check your router settings to ensure Multicast traffic is allowed, agin a toggle on / off in the routers settings.

 

[simbun]

Assuming you have the default subnet mask of 255.255.255.0 then mDNS discovery won't work without additional services running on the router (mDNS repeaters).

 

[d6jg]

Assuming you have the default subnet mask of 255.255.255.0 then mDNS discovery won't work without additional services running on the router (mDNS repeaters).

I think we are talking about a self build networking solution rather than a deliberate VLAN.

 

[hoohoohoo]

Now (my WiiM is on the Ethernet, while mobile phone on WiFi) I cannot really do anything in the WiiM Home app (on mobile phone): The WiiM device (in the app) is displayed as offline (from the point of view of the app). And rediscovery goes only through WiFi. So it looks that I cannot have LAN device and WiFi devices in the app.


Whole my home network started without WiFi at all. This was so till 2015 when I (maybe a little bit late ) switched myself from loved and best Nokia 6310i mobile phone to smartphone era. WiFi was only necessary for keeping my phone updated and also for my attempts of developing smartphone apps.
Only after slowly retiring myself I have started with development of home IOT and these small boxes start main usage of the WiFi connection while their central was/is securely kept on the LAN.

So why different networks?
I am from old school, remembering the time before Internet. For me it was (and still is) very natural to have routed networks, similar like having an extra firewall between Internet and my home network. (Safely ignoring crazy meshes like Philips bulbs etc.)
Additionally, at that time I was not interested in the "new" world of autodiscovery protocols that work only on 1 network.

Still one question is open:
Is the mutual exclusivity of WiFi and Ethernet on WiiM hard limit of HW, or limit of operating system used, or it is design decission of the application?

What brand/model is your router?

 

[simbun]

I think we are talking about a self build networking solution rather than a deliberate VLAN.

I've got to start reading posts in order!

So DIR-505 assigned IP from main router and put into router mode. Makes sense.

 

[hoohoohoo]

You can add this Ubiquiti device (UI-W6) to your existing setup. It will extend your existing D-Link switch ports to the WiiM wired Ethernet. As well, it creates a second WiFi that can be used to control the WiiM from your phone/tablet.

Access Point U6 In-Wall - Ubiquiti Store

Wall-mounted WiFi 6 AP with 6 spatial streams and a built-in 4-port switch ideal for single-room coverage in hospitality environments.

store.ui.com

A couple of things to know up front:
1) You'll need to add a PoE power injector (or a PoE switch) so that the UI-W6 gets power.
2) Ubiquiti uses an external device (laptop, server, docker container -- you decide) to manage all their devices including the UI-W6 -- https://help.ui.com/hc/en-us/articles/360012282453-Self-Hosting-a-UniFi-Network-Server

This vid should give you a feel for what it is...

 

[JirkaT]

but can it see your PC ?

But can it see your PC ?

It really depends, what you mean by "see your PC".
If you mean "access":
My PC (notebook on LAN) is accessible from mobile (on WiFi) using tcp/ip, I can e.g. ping it. (I do not have many services on the pc itself. Actually only NetBios but not having any corresponding app on the mobile to use it.)
Nevertheless on the LAN there is also a server that I can access from the mobile using ssh or connect NodeRed ui etc.

 

[jfbuk]

Hi JirkaT,

thanks for confirming.

Can you ping the Wiim from your phone ?

Given you have a different subnet for wifi I assume you are running the DLink DIR-505 in router mode so it has its own DHCP server managing the 192.168.10.x addresses. Is there a particular reason you are not running the DLink DIR-505 in bridge mode so that all the addresses are managed by the same DHCP server as your LAN ?
Others have deeper knowledge of the network behaviours of the Wiim devices but your problem could be that the network discovery protocol ports are being blocked by your firewall rules.

 

[JirkaT]

Can you ping the Wiim from your phone ?

Yes.

reason you are not running the DLink DIR-505 in bridge mode

Just to keep everything as it is. Additionally, according to my knowledge, DLink DIR-505 has no bridge mode. I hope that the router mode is also more secure.

My understanding now is that WiiM simply relies on implicit rule (not mentioned in any WiiM docu) that WiiM Home app must reside on the same network as WiiM device - Amp. This is because they rely on autodiscoveries that work only in current network.

For the initial configuration, the requirement of the same network is OK.

If WiiM Amp cannot use dual interface, then I can offer another idea:
It might be enough, to add an option (into WiiM Home app) to setup secondary ip address to the device configuration. This way the WiiM Home app would, in case that "normal" way of connecting to WiiB device does not succeed, try to connect to this secondary address.

BTW. It looks, that WiiM Amp (now connected via Ethernet) has both interfaces (Ethernet and WiFi) "live" at the same time!
I can minimally "see" both in Advanced IP scanner running on PC (Ethernet). And from mobile (WiFi) I can ping both.
It may indicate answer for my previous still unanswered question (from where the mutual exclusivity of both interface stems): it is not the hw that prohibits dual interface usage, the brake must be at some higher level (OS or app).