Linkplay evanescence

[WiiM Support]

Hi Team,

I want to jump in and give an explanation on why we need the regular updates -
1. We collect feedback from various users so we need to address their problems with the new firmware. Just so you know, your use case may be a small subset of the features provided by the product.
2. The devices report the exceptions/crashes to our device cloud so we address these exceptions and crashes based on the reports.
3. Our users are physically spread around the globe and we can't reproduce many issues in our lab (i.e., music service issues in certain regions). Sometimes, we rely on feedback from users from particular regions.
4. Streamer is only one component of your entire audio system. Many times, when you observe the problem, it may be caused by your other system component. Taking the pop noise as an example, some DACs can't handle properly the sample rate/bit-depth change between tracks with their optical and coaxial inputs that cause the pop/click noise. We have reproduced this with other streamers that perform the bit-perfect decoding and the problem is gone when using the fixed sample rate/bit-depth output (however, it degrades the audio quality with resampling).
5. Our streaming platform consists of many streaming protocols and music service integration. The SDK and API from our partners are frequently evolving as they'll also continue to fix bugs or provide new improvements. As an example, with the latest Spotify update, you can listen to Spotify podcasts on the WiiM devices now while you can't do that previously.

I hope it helps to clarify our standing on the firmware and App update. I'm looking forward to working with you all to improve these products further. So please feel free to let us know if you have any suggestions or comments. Thank you all very much!

 

[canard]

is it possible despite these types of efforts for bugs to continue in parallel to try to improve wiim home.. its ergonomics, a little of its functionalities, access to the meta-data provided etc..
lots of little things...
a list in my opinion quite long have you already known

I'm not talking about the use -developments of soft tier roon lms etc ... or eq etc
just from wiim home... for the daily life of many...
;-)

 

[onlyoneme]

FW updates were focused on New Features or Improvements. Not on the run-up to fixes and, it seems to me, that the Mini worked as it should.

Some of these issues solved recently were really old ones, like DLNA issues or unnecessary output switching when no sample rate change...
Plenty of issues have been introduced in the past because of the development focused on new features, in my opinion.

 

[Brantome]

I hope it helps to clarify our standing on the firmware and App update. I'm looking forward to working with you all to improve these products further. So please feel free to let us know if you have any suggestions or comments. Thank you all very much!

Many thanks for that and to the wider WiiM team for their continued efforts.

I’m sure users would also welcome some information on your feature roadmaps which don’t appear to have been updated for a while. I use some photography software and the supplier site has a feature request section where requests are classified as submitted, under review, declined, scheduled, working on it or launched - it would be informative if the feature requests on the forum or on the roadmap(s) were similarly classified to give users a better idea of what they might expect in the future.

 

[Brantome]

Some of these issues solved recently were really old ones, like DLNA issues or unnecessary output switching when no sample rate change...
Plenty of issues have been introduced in the past because of the development focused on new features, in my opinion.

Yeah, but it’s being argued the pendulum has swung too far the other way, and my personal opinion is that some middle ground is desirable where new features are added at a slower pace than before leaving resource to deal with the bugs that are almost inevitable in a complex development environment.

 

[onlyoneme]

Yeah, but it’s being argued the pendulum has swung too far the other way, and my personal opinion is that some middle ground is desirable where new features are added at a slower pace than before leaving resource to deal with the bugs that are almost inevitable in a complex development environment.

You're right, a kind of balance is necessary. It's just more important to me to have an issue free device as much as possible, than to have the one with a lot of functionalities but mostly bugged.

Quality over quantity, I would say.

 

[Maurizio]

is it possible despite these types of efforts for bugs to continue in parallel to try to improve wiim home.. its ergonomics, a little of its functionalities, access to the meta-data provided etc..
lots of little things...
a list in my opinion quite long have you already known

I'm not talking about the use -developments of soft tier roon lms etc ... or eq etc
just from wiim home... for the daily life of many...
;-)

Agreed

 

[Maurizio]

Many thanks for that and to the wider WiiM team for their continued efforts.

I’m sure users would also welcome some information on your feature roadmaps which don’t appear to have been updated for a while. I use some photography software and the supplier site has a feature request section where requests are classified as submitted, under review, declined, scheduled, working on it or launched - it would be informative if the feature requests on the forum or on the roadmap(s) were similarly classified to give users a better idea of what they might expect in the future.

Agreed

 

[Achim1811]

For me one of the reason for many complaints is simply a conflict between targets.
As I have learned over the years this is always making life for "creators" hard.
We have those interested more in sound. Bit-perfect f.e. as a must. Me is one of those.
We have those interested more in convenience. Telling a cube what to hear. That is not my target. But I understand.
We have those interested more or less in a combination of this wishes. That may be (?) the most. But for those WiiM is TODAY not the best solution.
And we have to consider not being centre of the Universe. Would be fine, but....
And so my conclusion is WiiM making a decent job. Never forget the price tag.

 

[Maurizio]

For me one of the reason for many complaints is simply a conflict between targets.
As I have learned over the years this is always making life for "creators" hard.
We have those interested more in sound. Bit-perfect f.e. as a must. Me is one of those.
We have those interested more in convenience. Telling a cube what to hear. That is not my target. But I understand.
We have those interested more or less in a combination of this wishes. That may be (?) the most. But for those WiiM is TODAY not the best solution.
And we have to consider not being centre of the Universe. Would be fine, but....
And so my conclusion is WiiM making a decent job. Never forget the price tag.

Good philosophy

 

[Smartplug]

Many thanks for that and to the wider WiiM team for their continued efforts.

I’m sure users would also welcome some information on your feature roadmaps which don’t appear to have been updated for a while. I use some photography software and the supplier site has a feature request section where requests are classified as submitted, under review, declined, scheduled, working on it or launched - it would be informative if the feature requests on the forum or on the roadmap(s) were similarly classified to give users a better idea of what they might expect in the future.

Future roadmap last updated was in February. We want more transparency on updates that has features. Good call!

 

[Smartplug]

I think before they release a firmware, there should be an army of beta testers on their end to ensure high quality release.

 

[Maurizio]

Hi Team,

I want to jump in and give an explanation on why we need the regular updates -
1. We collect feedback from various users so we need to address their problems with the new firmware. Just so you know, your use case may be a small subset of the features provided by the product.
2. The devices report the exceptions/crashes to our device cloud so we address these exceptions and crashes based on the reports.
3. Our users are physically spread around the globe and we can't reproduce many issues in our lab (i.e., music service issues in certain regions). Sometimes, we rely on feedback from users from particular regions.
4. Streamer is only one component of your entire audio system. Many times, when you observe the problem, it may be caused by your other system component. Taking the pop noise as an example, some DACs can't handle properly the sample rate/bit-depth change between tracks with their optical and coaxial inputs that cause the pop/click noise. We have reproduced this with other streamers that perform the bit-perfect decoding and the problem is gone when using the fixed sample rate/bit-depth output (however, it degrades the audio quality with resampling).
5. Our streaming platform consists of many streaming protocols and music service integration. The SDK and API from our partners are frequently evolving as they'll also continue to fix bugs or provide new improvements. As an example, with the latest Spotify update, you can listen to Spotify podcasts on the WiiM devices now while you can't do that previously.

I hope it helps to clarify our standing on the firmware and App update. I'm looking forward to working with you all to improve these products further. So please feel free to let us know if you have any suggestions or comments. Thank you all very much!

Please, look at my last post if you like. Published a few minutes ago "What I would in WHA"
Cheers

 

[adias]

Hi Adias,

Please send us feedback so we can look at your problems as soon as possible. Thank you!

I sent feedback through the app twice. And the replies I got were not encouraging. One of them seemed to indicate the change was an improvement!?!

I repeat here my latest communication:

The problem is:

1 - I connect TV sound to the WiiM Pro via toslink to SPDIF In.

2 - If I set auto sensing of SPDIF In ON, the WiiM Pro switches to SPDIF In if it detects a sound stream and that is OK.

3 - But... If the sound stream from the TV is interrupted, for example by pausing a recorded show, it now takes 3 sec to recover the sound when the TV is unpaused. This happens every time the TV is paused. This is very annoying.

4 - The previous firmware worked fine. Once the SPDIF In stream was set there would be no delays. I could pause the TV at will and no delays restarting.

So this is a problem. A problem that did not exist before. The previous firmware was fine and should not have changed this.

So... this should be fixed, or I want to go back to the previous firmware.

And yes… firmware updates should NEVER be automatic. The user should decide if he wants the update or not.

 

[adias]

Hi Team,

I want to jump in and give an explanation on why we need the regular updates -
1. We collect feedback from various users so we need to address their problems with the new firmware. Just so you know, your use case may be a small subset of the features provided by the product.
2. The devices report the exceptions/crashes to our device cloud so we address these exceptions and crashes based on the reports.
3. Our users are physically spread around the globe and we can't reproduce many issues in our lab (i.e., music service issues in certain regions). Sometimes, we rely on feedback from users from particular regions.
4. Streamer is only one component of your entire audio system. Many times, when you observe the problem, it may be caused by your other system component. Taking the pop noise as an example, some DACs can't handle properly the sample rate/bit-depth change between tracks with their optical and coaxial inputs that cause the pop/click noise. We have reproduced this with other streamers that perform the bit-perfect decoding and the problem is gone when using the fixed sample rate/bit-depth output (however, it degrades the audio quality with resampling).
5. Our streaming platform consists of many streaming protocols and music service integration. The SDK and API from our partners are frequently evolving as they'll also continue to fix bugs or provide new improvements. As an example, with the latest Spotify update, you can listen to Spotify podcasts on the WiiM devices now while you can't do that previously.

I hope it helps to clarify our standing on the firmware and App update. I'm looking forward to working with you all to improve these products further. So please feel free to let us know if you have any suggestions or comments. Thank you all very much!

One more reason to not force feed firmware updates to your customers. Make the firmware update OPT-IN. ASASP!

 

[Smartplug]

We been getting issues on firmware that the new one broke the old one. I think to resolve this issue wiim should provide a manual updates with several selection on firmware from latest down to old ones with 4 to choose from so users can pick which would work on system. Think like firmware on router where manufacturers provide all their firmware from old to new and it’s up to the users to pick their choice.

 

[adias]

We been getting issues on firmware that the new one broke the old one. I think to resolve this issue wiim should provide a manual updates with several selection on firmware from latest down to old ones with 4 to choose from so users can pick which would work on system. Think like firmware on router where manufacturers provide all their firmware from old to new and it’s up to the users to pick their choice.

Firmware updates should NOT be forced. They should be OPT-IN.

 

[WiiM Support]

I sent feedback through the app twice. And the replies I got were not encouraging. One of them seemed to indicate the change was an improvement!?!

I repeat here my latest communication:

The problem is:

1 - I connect TV sound to the WiiM Pro via toslink to SPDIF In.

2 - If I set auto sensing of SPDIF In ON, the WiiM Pro switches to SPDIF In if it detects a sound stream and that is OK.

3 - But... If the sound stream from the TV is interrupted, for example by pausing a recorded show, it now takes 3 sec to recover the sound when the TV is unpaused. This happens every time the TV is paused. This is very annoying.

4 - The previous firmware worked fine. Once the SPDIF In stream was set there would be no delays. I could pause the TV at will and no delays restarting.

So this is a problem. A problem that did not exist before. The previous firmware was fine and should not have changed this.

So... this should be fixed, or I want to go back to the previous firmware.

And yes… firmware updates should NEVER be automatic. The user should decide if he wants the update or not.

Hi Adias,

Thanks for the report. We can remove this 3-sec latency when there's no input switch. This 3-sec VAD detection is necessary when you're not in the SPDIF mode since you want to be sure there's a valid signal coming in then switch to that mode. Thank you!

 

[adias]

Hi Adias,

Thanks for the report. We can remove this 3-sec latency when there's no input switch. This 3-sec VAD detection is necessary when you're not in the SPDIF mode since you want to be sure there's a valid signal coming in then switch to that mode. Thank you!

Correct! Please do remove any delay once a sensed SPDIF In connection is made. Glad you understood the issue.

 

[WiiM Support]

Many thanks for that and to the wider WiiM team for their continued efforts.

I’m sure users would also welcome some information on your feature roadmaps which don’t appear to have been updated for a while. I use some photography software and the supplier site has a feature request section where requests are classified as submitted, under review, declined, scheduled, working on it or launched - it would be informative if the feature requests on the forum or on the roadmap(s) were similarly classified to give users a better idea of what they might expect in the future.

Hi Brantome,

Thank you for your suggestion on the future roadmap. We'll update the roadmap shortly. The classification of the feature requests is a great idea. I'll discuss this with our product team and see what we can do about it. Thank you!