Sound quality difference Plex vs. Amazon Unlimited through the Wiim

[nightrhyme]

To far away from Germany?
I will give the invitation also!

Not too far actually. I’m in Denmark

 

[Achim1811]

Hey...thats not far. We are just moving to the Northern Coast. Keep that in mind, my wife and I are both 72. So much easier for you

 

[nightrhyme]

Hey...thats not far. We are just moving to the Northern Coast. Keep that in mind, my wife and I are both 72. So much easier for you

 

[Achim1811]

She just hit me....71!

 

[Brantome]

Do you have 2 WiiMs?

When two Wiims are linked and played in Multiroom Music (MRM), Amazon Music also distributes UHD tracks in HD. Therefore, you can compare the same track in UHD and HD.

Only if you have two WiiM Pros, the WiiM minis don't have enough memory to support HD multi room - WiiM advise you to turn off the HD/UHD switch when using MRM with Minis

 

[Hollywood]

One example is ELP "From The Beginning", a song I loved for over 50 years and played countless times. The opening guitar just didn't have that clarity or pluck

I posted here citing that very song. In my case (also a FLAC rip from my CD collection) the first note is partially cut off. You hear the note mid-sound, so there is no "pluck". I posted about that here and opened up a support ticket.

I have several other apps that can play (cast) music to my WiiM and also to my phone. With those apps, that first note is still cut off (cast)ing to the WiiM, but not when sent directly to my phone (from the same server).

WiiM Support's reply was:
Thanks very much for reaching out to WiiM Support.
The issue is caused by the fade-in feature; we will add an option to turn it off next month, please stay tuned!
Best,
WiiM Support

This July is "next month" so I am waiting for it to finish before I ask again for a resolution.

I can't comment on overall sound quality as my hearing is not that good with age, but as you wrote we do know some of out favorite tracks well and know how they should sound or if something is off or missing.

 

[Houma]

@Achim1811. Du schlimmer, wie kannst Du nur 1 Jahr unterschlagen
Aber mal im Ernst. Wir sind beide gleich alt. Mich würde mal interessieren, ob Du (natürlich auch unsere gleichaltrigen Kollegen) wirklich einen Unterschied (nur einen Unterschied, nicht besser oder schlechter) hörst, wenn Du einen anderen DAC anschließt.
Ich habe es mal mit einem wirklich nur einfachen FiiO Taishan D03K probiert. Ich höre da nicht den geringsten Unterschied zum eingebauten DAC. Wahrscheinlich höre ich das gar nicht mehr. Oder ist der Taishan einfach "zu billig"?
Ich wollte eigentlich auf den Pro+ updaten, ob sich das aber für mich rechnet? Ich bezweifle es. Der Pro (ohne +) hört sich für mich perfekt an. Ob da eine Steigerung beim Pro+ für mich möglich ist?

 

[Achim1811]

@Achim1811. Du schlimmer, wie kannst Du nur 1 Jahr unterschlagen
Aber mal im Ernst. Wir sind beide gleich alt. Mich würde mal interessieren, ob Du (natürlich auch unsere gleichaltrigen Kollegen) wirklich einen Unterschied (nur einen Unterschied, nicht besser oder schlechter) hörst, wenn Du einen anderen DAC anschließt.
Ich habe es mal mit einem wirklich nur einfachen FiiO Taishan D03K probiert. Ich höre da nicht den geringsten Unterschied zum eingebauten DAC. Wahrscheinlich höre ich das gar nicht mehr. Oder ist der Taishan einfach "zu billig"?
Ich wollte eigentlich auf den Pro+ updaten, ob sich das aber für mich rechnet? Ich bezweifle es. Der Pro (ohne +) hört sich für mich perfekt an. Ob da eine Steigerung beim Pro+ für mich möglich ist?

Du hast ne PM

 

[FerengiROA]

Update: after spending a lot of time streaming to the Wiim from my Plex server, which is mostly WAV/FLAC files, I've found that there are some songs that sound better than AM.
Not every song, by any means, but enough to notice an improvement.

The Plex has more punch and less veil, IMO. In spite of this, I will keep using AM to discover new music and stream the songs that I don't have in my personal library.

And, I found roughly 300 CDs that I forgot about. Luckily, they are all ripped in lossless so time saved. Just listening to Fleetwood Mac "Rumours" and forgot how good that sounds.

The Wiim easily connected to the Plex server. So, now I have 3 great options to listen; CD, Plex and AM.

Thanks to everyone's input and experiences.

 

[CrystalGipsy]

The one on AM is likey a completely different master than the one you have on CD, likey a more recent remaster with different dynamic range, usually they are compressed to hell compared to older CD releases. This is common on every streaming services. You can’t compare the quality of the two inputs unless you know they are exactly the same version of an album using exactly the same mastering. Read up on the loudness wars and you will understand.

This is a good site to compare dynamic range of different releases.

Album list - Dynamic Range DB

 

[Houma]

Darum bin ich sehr vorsichtig eine Aussage zu machen, welcher DAC besser oder schlechter ist. Pro oder Pro+ zum Beispiel. Ich habe noch nirgendwo über einen direkten Hörvergleich gelesen. Jede Meinung über irgendeinen Sound kann nur subjektiv sein. Jeder hat einen anderen Eindruck was ihm gefällt oder nicht. Und eines ist klar. Alle Streamingdienste tricksen.

 

[FerengiROA]

The one on AM is likey a completely different master than the one you have on CD, likey a more recent remaster with different dynamic range, usually they are compressed to hell compared to older CD releases. This is common on every streaming services. You can’t compare the quality of the two inputs unless you know they are exactly the same version of an album using exactly the same mastering. Read up on the loudness wars and you will understand.

This is a good site to compare dynamic range of different releases.

Album list - Dynamic Range DB

Your explanation makes perfect sense. Explains the discrepancies that I'm hearing. Another reason I'm fortunate to have ripped my entire CD collection before I started to think out the bulk.

 

[CrystalGipsy]

Your explanation makes perfect sense. Explains the discrepancies that I'm hearing. Another reason I'm fortunate to have ripped my entire CD collection before I started to think out the bulk.

Main reason I’m on a large 2nd hand cd buying spree. Also fed up with music being removed.

 

[FerengiROA]

Main reason I’m on a large 2nd hand cd buying spree. Also fed up with music being removed.

Speaking of 2nd hand discs, do you buy from an online source, local, etc? Thinking of doing the same but concerned about damaged/unplayable CDs. Thanks for any leads.

 

[d6jg]

My 2p on this.
If you listen to a recently released album I find it makes almost no difference whether it’s via a streaming service or a CD. It’s the same master. Even a vinyl version sounds only marginally different in the way only vinyl does.
If however you listen to some very well known classic from yesteryear then a whole host of different factors apply to make it sound different depending on version, source etc

 

[Brantome]

in a similar vein… https://darko.audio/2023/08/when-hi-res-audio-cant-compete-with-vinyl/

 

[d6jg]

in a similar vein… https://darko.audio/2023/08/when-hi-res-audio-cant-compete-with-vinyl/

Just can’t make my mind up about Darko. Here he talks a lot of (mostly obvious) sense but in other circumstances it’s all subjective … stronger midranges, deeper bottoms nonsense.

 

[Smartplug]

I had all these major streaming services so I would rank them best first. This my subjective comment and everyone has different option and take. Qobuz, tidal, amazon.

 

[kevingc]

Dumb question: what is plex , in a nut shell?

 

[dssme]

I have been using the Wiim Pro for about 2 months now and I just noticed something that I was not expecting at all.

First, some data. I am using Amazon Unlimited after trials of the Big 3 Hi-Res services. I felt that I didn't hear enough of a consistent improvement, if any, between A, Q & T.

I am outputting Coax from the Wiim to a SMSL DAC/HP amp combo.

First, the good. The sound on most tracks is really clear and drums are nice and tight on good recordings. I'm doing most of my listening on headphones that I have had for around 6 years so I am very familiar with their sound signature.

But, lately, when I listen to songs that I am very familiar with, I had the sense that something was just different. I felt some of the liveliness or airiness was not as I had remembered it.

One example is ELP "From The Beginning", a song I loved for over 50 years and played countless times. The opening guitar just didn't have that clarity or pluck that I knew was there. The track is 24 bit/96khz. Plus, the noise/hiss is more than I remember.

I am using WiFi as my connection type and have fiber so speed or stability is not an issue. Excellent signal strength 24/7.

So, I played the same song from my Plex server through the Wiim Home Music Share; 16bit WAV file, and immediately noticed that the Plex WAV sounded better. It sounded how I always remembered it. The guitar had that luster back and the noise was also reduced. Tried a few other songs that I know very well and had very similar outcomes. What I can't understand, though, is why? Both ways are streamed on wifi, both are in either WAV or HiRes and equipment is the same. Only the stream is different.
This is not a subtle or inconclusive finding. I clearly hear the improvement using my Plex server. And, using an SPL, I volume matched almost identically, on my loudspeakers and headphones.

If anyone knows that song and can do a comparison, I would be curious as to what findings you come up with.

Don't get me wrong. I am not crapping on the Wiim. It's been rock solid since I got it but I felt something was just "off".

Any thoughts?

My guess is that the streaming services version was remastered and the Plex CD copy is just better
I've experienced this before on more music than I thought I could ever imagine
Every audio system is improved by better sources
And the most important source is the recorded master